I love the part about counting time. I always found it remarkable how pioneers seemed to count so much more time than the other publishers. I remarked on several occasions about what good is it if they're devoting all this time and then cheating on the time sheet. Jehovah would know and then he might kill them for being dishonest and in the end it wouldn't really be worth it, would it?
Eiben Scrood
JoinedPosts by Eiben Scrood
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37
Notes from "Safeguard Your Conscience" Special Assembly Day
by WinstonSmith inrecently we had the 'privilege' of attending our local special assembly day.
the theme for this year was safeguard your conscience, and you guessed it, they looked up every reference to the word 'conscience' in the bible and then wrote a talk about each one.
it was most definitely a case of "pack your bags, we're going on a guilt trip.".
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Thoughts on how to approach (or NOT approach) our loved ones.
by Londo111 inhttp://vimeo.com/15963095.
im sure this has been reiterated over the years again and again.. .
but how we approach our jw loved ones may either free them...or drive them further into the organization and away from us.
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Eiben Scrood
So I made the mistake of being critical. In my defense, they were the ones that came after me and I was defending my reasons for leaving the cult. But now the damage is done. I should have just been evasive. They know I'm not disfellowshiped but they're still very cold. Is there any hope of undoing the damage and trying the gentle approach?
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Anyone else in "limbo?"
by KitchenWitDinah ini've been out of the organization for about 4 years now, but have been in limbo since i've left.
the more i learn about world religions, the less apt i am to accept anything as truth, since there are so many similarities between so many religions.
i know many cultures have flood myths involving 40-ish days and 8 survivors (the chinese written language has many surprising allusions to biblical stories).
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Eiben Scrood
I believe in a Creator. I'm not sure of much else. There BS in all religions and perhaps some truth too. I think learning to accept the mystery and the fact that no one has all the answers is a big part of leaving the cult and coming to at least some peace about living your life as best you can. The Watchtower and its slaves thrive on claiming to provide the ultimate truth when in reality, it's all a big mirage.
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New here
by Change Name ini had been studying with the jehovah's witnesses for the last couple years.
they have been interesting study sessions and have learned quite a bit about them and their beliefs.
much of what they teach is what i had learned through personal bible study.. growing up was normal.
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Eiben Scrood
Obviously a troll.
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WT Elders school: Avoid black and white thinking - now look at this zebra
by sir82 incontinuing on with my haphazard review of the recent one-day elders school..... in one of the introductory talks, the co was making the point that we can't view things merely from a black and white perspective.
many issues have "shades of gray" and we need to use discernment in such situations.. and i'm thinking "finally!
maybe he will continue on to make an actual, reasonable point!".
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Eiben Scrood
I condemn the Watchtower for their stance but I think the examples supplied in this thread show how contradictory the Bible itself is. What kind of maniacal God can kill someone for picking up sticks and then let a murderer go free? Then he scraps the whole system for a supposedly kinder one until he writes Revelation where the slaughter reaches the bridles of the horses.
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Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-18-2012 WT Study (KNOW DAY HOUR)
by blondie inday or the hour of the end?.
knowing the exact day or hour when the.
5. how may not knowing the day or the hour.
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Eiben Scrood
Bless you Blondie. I have reached the point that reading any of their bullshit makes me want to dig out my eyes with my fingernails. I'm amazed you can tolerate what you do.
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My Experience in the Watchtower (Part Two)
by Eiben Scrood ini had related the first part of my story in part one.
thanks for all the responses and sorry for the wait for part two!
part two obviously won't make as much sense if part one hasn't been read.. here is my continuing story:.
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Eiben Scrood
I had related the first part of my story in Part One. Thanks for all the responses and sorry for the wait for part two! Part two obviously won't make as much sense if part one hasn't been read.
Here is my continuing story:
For quite some time I had been in the habit of immediately turning to the inside cover of each Awake! magazine to see if it continued to reference ‘the Creator’s promise of a new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away.’ I had a premonition that something would be changing though of course I hoped I was wrong. That single teaching had had a profound effect upon the choices I had been making for a long time. I often would share it in the ministry – both formal and informal – as a way to encourage the listener to take action.
Let’s face it: it was pretty exciting! I had even begun to date some letters using a time-of-the-end date system. For instance, October 1, 1993 would be time-of-the-end date 79.000. The countdown was on to eternal life in happiness without ever having to die. I could make do with my present circumstances knowing what was soon to come.
Was I serving Jehovah with a date in mind as the Watchtower loves to accuse some of doing? Perhaps, but where did that date come from? Why, it came through God’s exclusive channel to mankind itself! It was proof the time left is reduced (1 Corinthians 7:29). I really did have appreciation for what I felt was Jesus’ role in salvation and for what God had made. I did honestly want to serve Him but given the brevity of time remaining, I was running a sprint rather than planning for a full life of service.
So, after removing that November 1995 Watchtower from its subscription wrapper, I began perusing it as I did all new magazines when they arrive. I noticed the titles of the study articles referring once again to the importance of staying alert to our times. I thought at first that this would be further reinforcement of the generation of 1914 teaching. Instead, it soon became apparent to me that the Watchtower was slyly using such language to try to ameliorate the effect of changing the teaching in that article. They tried to make it seem as if this was no big deal – just carry on, nothing to see here, keep on cleaning and pioneering and living in your parents’ basement.
The feeling of the rug being swept out from under my feet was so palpable that I felt dizzy. I was stunned and kept rereading it. When the full force of what I read finally hit me, I distinctly remember taking the magazine and hurling it across the room. My parents happened to be away at the time so I couldn’t immediately confront them. It felt like my whole reality was changing right before my eyes.
It wasn’t long before I started talking to my close friends about it. When my parents got home from their trip I unleashed my anger at the organization to them. What could they say? My mother just acknowledged that she had to repeatedly read it herself but that her faith was unwavering and she parroted all the justification that the religion always gives for such drastic changes in doctrine.
I skipped a few meetings, something I had never intentionally done in my life. But then I began to think and reason. What were my immediate choices? I had a part-time job making collection calls which certainly wouldn’t come close to being enough income to support myself. I didn’t know anyone well who wasn’t part of the religion so finding a roommate wouldn’t be very easy. My parents were willing to overlook my initial outburst but I knew they would be very resistant to the idea of an inactive person living in their house.
Then there was the fact that I had already invested so much into this. The thought of not being part of something that gave me all the answers and provided such a wonderful hope was too much to bear at the time. Maybe the Watchtower was right. Maybe nothing had really changed. Maybe. Maybe not. I prayed, I had a “shepherding” call from the elders, I studied. I would carry on as best I could. For a while it seemed to work. I tried to be reasonably zealous again but it really wouldn’t last. It was like trying to patch something that is beyond repair and the temporary fixes were destined to fail.
I soon turned 24 and a welcome development occurred with regards to my secular work. A Witness elder who was close to my family worked for a large company and had some say in who it hired. An accounting team was being formed and I knew some Witnesses who were getting positions. My parents encouraged me to call him and inquire and that’s what I did. He liked that I had had over three years of office experience at that point and said that if I completed an accounting course at a local college, he would see what he could do for me. It was probably as close as he could get to guaranteeing me a position. I had to show him that I had the initiative to take this course and do well but the reward of a fulltime position at a large company was more than enough to motivate me. I was very sick of making collection calls and probably could not have continued much longer doing that anyway.
I took the course and got an A. I felt so fulfilled to be investing my time in something other than the religion and something that would have a definitely positive effect on my present-day future – not some future life that the Bible itself says no one knows when its arrival will be. My heart was still somewhat in the religion and I certainly had to carry out the motions of it because this was an elder who was helping me get this job.
I had always wanted to grow my hair long. Even as a small boy I thought this would be the coolest thing ever. Of course, I could not have picked a worse culture than Watchtowerland to have this desire. Around this time I began to grow my bangs and the hair on top of my head longer while keeping the back shorter. This allowed me to slick it back for congregational activities thus concealing its length but still enjoy longish hair at other times by letting it fall naturally. I have to say that I was part of a “cool” congregation in that I was never spoken to about it. I know such an act of semi-rebellion would never have been tolerated in other congregations. It just felt good to be discovering myself more – the real me – not a sanitized Watchtower version. I began to explore my interest in various genres of music that were prohibited. I even bought a Black Sabbath album at the time. I thought demons were sure to be coming right out of my car stereo! Much of the music buying was of a binge and purge variety. I would buy albums of bands I love, “repent” and throw them away, only to buy them again later!
Shortly after finishing this accounting course, I took a two week trip across the country with a friend. This was my second of such trips and it impacted me even more than the first one. It broadened my scope of what life was like in the “world” as we visited places like San Francisco and saw a very untheocratic slice of the population. After getting back from that trip, I quit my job doing the collection work even though I didn’t know a start date for my promised accounting job. It turned out that there would be a six week gap.
By this time my hair in front reached my lips but I cut it shortly before my first day at the new job. I missed it but wanted to focus completely on getting acclimated to this new opportunity. This totally felt like a real job. It was fulltime and in a much more professional office environment than I was used to. The learning curve was very steep as I had very limited computer skills at that point and the accounting skills I had learned in school were only marginally applicable to my new work. At times I felt overwhelmed but I soldiered on and gradually started to feel more at home.
One of the Watchtower’s favorite ways of guilting its adherents is to ask them if they can justify before Jehovah why they are not pioneering. Well, no, I couldn’t. I was still living at home but now working fulltime and only doing the ministry perhaps one day per week. I felt the guilt but I didn’t care nearly as much as I would have in the past. Not only was I feeling more productive in life but I also felt more hopeful because with now having a decent job I had the prospect of being able to get married and actually have a real life. It wouldn’t be long before such an opportunity presented itself…
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Help! I'm having serious thoughts about going back
by lola28 inhello old friends, i've been thinking about going back and need you all to give me your thoughts on it.. the last year has been a horribe one for me, in the span of less than a year the following things have happened to me:.
lost my mom to cancergot hit by a carhad a professional set back that will cost over 600k to resolveended a three and a half year relationshipit just feels like every time i think things are going to get better something else hits me and knocks me down, a small part of me wonders wether i brought all these things on myself because i left the organization (yes i know how silly that sounds) and i have given serious thought about going back.
i need you guys to talk me out of it!.
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Eiben Scrood
"Now, after leaving the religion, I am left with a void. A void that is going to take a lot of healing and learning and growing to fill. But I would rather be uncertain about life, the future, God and everything else than to live a lie."
Well said and exactly how I feel. It was such a nice hope and maybe part of it is true but this organization is not, it destroys a person's spirit and sucks any kind of true joy out of a person's life.
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Disfellowshipped!
by Las Malvinas son Argentinas inlibertad!
though my story is a bit more complicated than that.
i live in argentina.
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Eiben Scrood
But wait, wouldn't holy spirit be able to guide the local elders to not reinstate her if her motives were not pure? I mean, holy spirit always works, right?
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Pioneers and Their Way of Counting "Time"
by Eiben Scrood inin the congregations in my area there was an expression to the effect that 'there's counting time and then there's the way pioneers count their time'.
the watchtower's guidelines were pretty strict on when time could be counted.
some pioneers followed it and others didn't.. on particularly motivated young man comes to mind, he would work full-time or close to it and pioneer.
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Eiben Scrood
outsmartthesystem - that was a great synopis of a typical day for those engaged in this critical life-saving work.
Now we know how foolish the whole time thing is but when you were in it and still believing in this "work", did it not bother your conscience when you fudged a little (or a lot)? The whole point of being out there was to try to earn your salvation so wouldn't it defeat the purpose of it to cheat on the time card?